The Resurrection of Retail
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Streaming here
It isn’t a secret that retail has had a rough year. The global COVID-19 pandemic has forced many brands to rethink the way they reach, serve, and retain their customers through brick and mortar retail… but what if this is only the beginning?
On this week’s episode of Commerce Chef’s, Kyle and Tom chat with expert George Gleeson, a consultant at the illustrious Boston Consulting Group, Matt Taylor, Director of Insights at Jamieson Vitamins, and Julia Chan, Director of Ecommerce at 49th Parallel and previous leader at Lululemon and Sage.
Together they discuss retail’s current landscape, the tension between brick and mortar and online offerings, and why “omnichannel” isn’t just another buzzword - but the needed way of doing business.
Learn more about our guests:
EP. 7 TRANSCRIPT
Kyle It's about time where we all need a little vacay. So today we're going to take you on a journey.
Tom A virtual vacation.
Kyle Come with me. You're walking down the beach. You feel the sand squishing between your toes.
Tom Squish, squish.
Kyle Sounds nice. The sound of gentle waves crashing on the shore.
Tom *Waves SFX*.
Kyle Birds can be heard in the background.
Tom *Bird noises*.
Kyle And the laughter of children fills the air.
Tom *Evil laughter*.
Kyle OK, that's terrifying. Don't we normally have a sound effects editor for this?
Tom Yeah, they're on virtual vacation, though.
Kyle OK, OK. You see a sailboat off in the distance.
Tom Look at this picture.
Kyle That's a nice boat. And you feel a warm breeze on your face.
Tom *Breathing*.
Kyle OK, firstly, that's really gross. Secondly, I can't feel your breath through the Internet.
Tom That will be 7000 dollars, please. I hope you enjoyed your vacation.
Kyle For a B-list sleep story and a series of unfortunate sound effects?
Tom I was building the experience. It's virtually the same thing.
Kyle Some things are just better in person.
Tom Well some things are better than nothing, Kyle.
Kyle You're right. Thanks for trying.
Tom Thank you.
Kyle We're still on for Zoom Zumba tonight, right?
Tom We've gone over this man. We just say Zumba. Just Zumba.
Kyle Right.
Tom Welcome to Commerce Chefs, a quirky and thought-provoking show for future focused commerce leaders. We're going to pit the world's most brilliant, inspiring and driven D2C visionaries, the commerce chefs with riveting questions to uncover their secret ingredients at the intersection of passion, performance and leadership and practice.
Kyle For the past decade, we've led teams of designers, strategists and digital wizards at one of the leading eCom agencies in the country to help brave brands become enduring classics.
Tom And we're here to indefinitely borrow the strategies and pro tips that will make us all better leaders and make the brands we lead better too.
Kyle And just just to recap it, it's just Zumba right?
Tom Yes, Kyle.
Kyle Retail! The great fortress of commerce!
Tom This strong standing goldmine of consumer stampedes and curbside campouts, now- well, closed for the indefinite future, maybe even changed forever.
Kyle In twenty twenty, brick and mortar retail was forced to adapt quickly. COVID-19 changed the way that brands interact with their customers and e-commerce jumped into prominence in a way that was anticipated to be a decade into the future.
Tom So the pandemic aside, what does the future look like for brands in finding and engaging with their customers? And will there even be a choice between a physical experience and a digital one?
Kyle To help us decipher the new world of retail from a different perspective, we chatted with George Gleeson, a CPA, former VP of finance and ops and currently a consultant at the illustrious Boston Consulting Group.
George I think a couple of things come to mind there. The first one is thinking about the role that the brick and mortar plays specifically in the omnichannel landscape going forward. I think brick and mortar does still play an important role in that landscape once we get through COVID and there is the opportunity to go into stores. But I think the role that it plays will shift. And again, pre COVID already seeing some of that shift starting to happen. But I really do think COVID has been the catalyst for a greater shift. And what I mean by shift is rather than a store location being a singular profit center, it becomes part of a brand omni channel marketing strategy. So frankly, if it come across the line, often in the PNL of of a brand or organization, and so consumers come to that brick and mortar location for that brand experience of the product or service, probably staffed with the ateam of brand ambassadors or employees to help augment the brand. And then I think there is likely to be more of that digital augmentation as well. You know, get a little fancy with with AR and VR and that sort of thing to to create that that holistic experience for the consumer. And then probably still a point of sale option in the brick and mortar location. But that's not the primary purpose of location. It's to build the brand. It's to garner brand equity. And but it's less transactional than it was previously.
Tom To get another take on this, we brought in Matt Taylor, a decades experienced CPG marketer in the Health and Wellness space and currently the director of consumer insights at Canada's most prominent wellness brand, Jamieson Vitamins.
Kyle He's been on the front lines of a shift from brick and mortar to online and is a product company that deals exclusively with retailers. We wanted to get his take on what this means for the future of consumer behavior.
Matt There's been these just situational drivers of change. We were in a lockdown. People couldn't go where they used to go. We have seen some recent data showing that in grocery and drug, there's this increased importance of millennials. And the thinking is that millennials used to spend a lot more than anyone else on restaurants. But restaurants are closed, so they have nowhere else to go but now into grocery stores and drugstores and spend their their food money. Lockdown just forced people to make new decisions, it's not so much a relationship with brands as more of the situation we're in and the behaviors are changing. But then we looked at how our brands are winning. And there's this fun theory in psychology called the terror management theory and the idea in terror management theory, they propose that a lot of the decisions that we make in life are to ease the anxiety we have about our mortality. In this theory there's mortality salience and mortality salience is as we become more aware of our mortality, our behavior starts to change. And so we get a few different things, one is that we start focusing more on safety and preservation and security, where we start to hoard resources like toilet paper outages and we try to protect our existence. The second one is about empowerment, where we are trying to find a new way to thrive. So how do we take control of our situation and not just be safe, but do something new? And then the third one is all about distraction and the desire to just get away from the stress and the anxiety of our mortality. There's a researcher, a behavioral science researcher named William Leach and William Leach talks about how in twenty twenty there is this increased importance of a three key consumer needs. That link directly to this: is security, control and release. And those needs security, control, and release become goals of safety, empowerment and engagement. So let's take a look at the marketplace. So in safety and security, we see the rise of vitamins because people are trying to protect their health. We see a rise in making healthier choices. We see a rise in nostalgic products, buying things we used to eat as a kid because it makes us feel safe and secure and like times are simpler again and then engagement we see like chess, how chessboards are on fire because the Queen's Gambit. But that's just an example of how we're looking for ways to release ourselves from the anxiety of a pandemic and this desire to engage our senses. So to me, when we understand that these increased importance of these drivers of behavior, we can understand why certain categories have been on fire in the last year and then why brands inside of those categories are winning more than their fair share, because those brands, I believe, are delivering on those needs in a way that consumers understand. And so really the development of relationship with consumers. And how has that changed in twenty twenty we go through cycles of through different seasons, different needs become stronger. I believe it's the brands and categories that have delivered on those needs in a way that is unique and interesting and authentic, have developed a stronger relationship with consumers and we can enjoy the benefits of that. And they can have their life served by brands like ours that are here for them when they need us.
Kyle Tom, what are your thoughts on mortality salience that Matt mentioned?
Tom It really hit me pretty hard. I mean, to to reference your buying behaviors from a sense of kind of the biggest consideration in life, which is our own mortality. That's something pretty, pretty serious. But it makes a lot of sense. Right. You're you're making decisions to to purchase things to engage with brands or products that you feel you need based on your sense of need. So obviously, you know, this goes back to a hierarchy of needs and at certain times or stages in life or maybe economic or social factors like a pandemic that's going to call focus on things that that may be different. But question back to you, Kyle. We can't stay in this kind of this sort of mortality focused state forever. So how do you think brands are going to move past this once the pandemic starts to to die down a little?
Kyle I think in some ways it doesn't go away right. Like part of the the psychology behind it is that like at the root of so much of what we do and what we what we buy to be part of these, you know, cultures and kind of different parts of our lives. So I think the first thing is I don't think brands need to completely forget that that's happening. I think that needs to be something that's like stays there as a base level. However, I think it's not so evident when you're not in a pandemic, you kind of move beyond survival and start to look into a thrivival sort of thing. Is that a thing?
Tom Yeah, it is now.
Kyle Also moving from like. Yeah, just this evidence of like needing to be so focused on survival and then moving into what is it, what does it look like for thriving in my customers, like what are they looking to do and experience and be in order to feel thriving when they're not so focused on just surviving? And I think if we can answer that question, that's where brands need to move after we get out of this kind of constant focus on just, you know, surviving.
Tom Right. And it's not really just even focus on brands moving past mortality saliency. Matt also talked about there just being depending on the stage of your buyer. You know everybody when they're in their twenties thinks they're invincible. They're never going to die. They can do whatever they want and nothing bad is going to happen to them. And that perspective just changes naturally as you get older, as you get closer to the finish line, as it were. It also is just a matter of brands keeping a pulse on where their customer's at in their life journey.
Kyle Yeah, that's a great point. And Matt, continued with this.
Matt I believe that E-comm as a thing, is not going away, but I also believe that brick and mortar retail will always have a place in our lives. But the question becomes, what does retail need to look like to continue to have a place in our lives? Nike had saw this coming and back in twenty seventeen. They discontinued sales through thousands of retail stores because they were not creating the elevated experience that Nike demanded for its brand. Nike stop selling on Amazon because they recognize the need for your brand to create and be part of a larger experience. And I think that there will be a place for that go in, pick up at a reasonable price retail. But in the more premium brands, it's going to be about how do you create some kind of an experience? How do you try it? How do you have that experience with the brand? If it's a knowledge based, whether you go in and you can talk to an associate or you go in and there's some kind of an analysis for you, like running rooms, they check your feet, they watch you run, and then they give you shoes, vitamins, you go to a specialty store or a pharmacy, you talk to a professional, they give you some advice and you do that. So, Doug Stephens, the retail profit, he talks about how retail is media. We can't view a store as just a place of transactions. We need to see it as an opportunity to tell a story. Everything around us and our brand is content for the story of what we're trying to do. And then how do you transfer that to digital? We need to understand what is the entirety of the story we're trying to tell with our brand and then how can we make it come to life in in brick and mortar? What is the piece of it that can be most authentic digitally and that becomes the omni channel experience of our brand?
Kyle Matt's perspective is almost from the other side of George's, in some ways. He's starting with retail first and thinking about the elements of the customer experience that can be translated effectively online.
Tom Yeah, and meanwhile, George is really talking about taking a prominent online experience and using in-person as a way to enhance what customers can experience through their screens and expand that and build on that experience. Not to mention the practicality, though, of how they can more effectively serve and meet customer demands and expectations.
Kyle So, Tom, I think we need to go back to one fundamental question.
Tom And what's that?
Kyle What exactly are brands trying to accomplish with their retail strategy? Or better yet, what should they be trying to accomplish?
Tom You know, Matt had another really great answer to that.
Matt So Amazon is going to win the speed in price and Walmart, they're battling it out for speed and price. Anyone else that is trying to sell direct to consumer, it needs to be about something different than that. And of course, there's table stakes you need to deliver in a certain amount of time. Nobody wants to pay for shipping, but then it becomes, what story are you telling? And why should someone care to buy this thing from you when they could buy either the same thing on Amazon? And how do we win in e-comm going forward when there's already something for the thing you're trying to sell is creating equity around something meaningful and different. That your customer or consumer cares about. So how are you meaningfully different for them? So I think about marketing as becoming part of or serving a culture. As a product or brand, you are in a category that is ultimately inside of a culture, and culture is a collection of shared meanings and beliefs. So in our world, we're in the culture of natural health. Another business might be in the culture of entrepreneurship. Inside of that culture, who are those who are driving change? Who are those who are looking for a solution? And if you design your retail brand or your brand or your e-commerce site to serve that core culture with amazing content with the things they want to hear about. And then the next layer, those who want to be part of the culture but are not the driving force of the culture. And it starts to spread that way. But it all comes down to what's shared beliefs you have with your consumer, what is culturally relevant to them, what tensions do they have in their life? Why would they participate in this in this thing of life with you? Being authentic to that and that's how things start to grow. We've got to try and figure out what culture you're serving and what content can you produce for that culture, because price and convenience, you're probably not going to win that battle.
Kyle So how then, as leaders, do we figure out how to connect with our customers in a way that is culturally relevant, like Matt mentioned?
Tom Well, we sat down with Julia Chan, the director of e-commerce, at 49th Parallel, a coffee company out of Vancouver that's hyper focused on creating unique experiences for their customers. Now, Julia's previously held e-commerce leadership roles at Lululemon and Saje. So I think it's safe to say she knows a little bit about what she's talking about.
Julia Yeah, like with coffee. I think what I've learned, like being at 49th this past year is like with e-commerce. I want to think about like, what else can we offer to the consumer because they're not able to taste the coffee or like sit down in our cafe and like have a conversation with a barista, with their friends, have a latte and so like digitally we've been focusing a lot on educating or providing content about how to brew the best coffee or how to use your espresso machine and dial in origin like roasts and highlighting our team's favorite coffees. I think that way we can provide more education to the consumer so they can kind of experience or be able to take that experience home if they haven't been able to in this past year. I think, like in my sense of working at Saje, Lululemon and like 49th is that translating the physical experience online is, is the challenge. And because you're not able to walk in a store and shop the essential oils from the wall and smell it and someone's not telling you the story or you're not able to really try on the clothes physically or drink that coffee. So then how do you translate it online and how you would do then online, you have words and you have visuals. So it's like, what can you do with that? And so I think like being able to really tell that story through content, through video, like a consumer doesn't see things as like separate channels. That's like, OK, I'm just shopping at Lululemon or I'm just shopping at Saje. I may be buying something on their Instagram page, but I'm shopping with Saje. I'm not shopping with Instagram. It's kind of like kind of like the the everything is like intersected and layered together. And I think from a consumer's perspective, like that's, that's kind of the expectation and the new norm.
Tom So what Julia and George were really mentioning here is the importance of taking an omnichannel approach with your brand and retail strategy.
Kyle But how do you decide what the dominant elements of that approach should be?
Tom George put forward a few key ingredients to consider.
George It feels like there are natural inflection points for any brand. And the word inflection point is, actually believe it or not used intentionally as a second derivative of, say, revenue typically sales. So at a point in time when, say, a native DTC e-comm brand is perhaps starting to experience a slowing of their acceleration on the sales front, then perhaps that's an opportunity to unleash a new pillar of an omni channel strategy, perhaps of bricks and mortar retail environment to hopefully pick up that acceleration again and ensure that the inflection point tilts in the right direction and doesn't start a downward trend. So, you know, frankly, I. I wish I knew specifically what that metric was and when the exact timing would be. That's but you look at a brand like an Allbirds or whatever the case may be, it seems like there are certain critical inflection points. And I've got to think a big part of it would be sales or top line or net promoter score or something like that, that either they're they're seeing an acceleration and an opportunity to double down on it or potentially an early indicator of a lagging effect that they want to to remedy through a different omni, a different pillar of the omni channel approach. I think there's like a few different components to that sort of thing. The first is to be successful. That customer facing front end user experience has to be there. The second one is, again, back to that logistics and facilitation of that purchase. You've now made a promise, no matter what channel it is, that you need to fulfill as a brand. So having the underlying infrastructure or at least the right logistics partners to be able to deliver on that is is so critical. And I think the- A) the ability to execute on that and to fulfill that promise, also, being able to communicate and track in real time throughout that delivery cycle, I think is really important, too, for management of expectations. And then the third, it's around the omni channel, data ingestion and utilization. And I think that's where the real magic can happen. If a brand is able to marry all of those omni channel customer data points and preferences, they create a huge advantage in things like the next perfect purchase suggestion, targeted advertising, promotional campaigns, things like that. And that inherently then leads to a better overall customer experience, which feeds back into that front end experience. And you create a virtuous cycle for your brand that is really enabled by omni channel.
Kyle What are your thoughts, Tom, on the three layers that George mentioned of companies who are doing retail right.
Tom I think it's actually probably because they're not just looking at it as solely a retail strategy, as George mentioned, essentially the front end experience or showcasing the promise that they're going to give. They then have the second piece, which is essentially the logistics. How are we then going to deliver that to our customer? And then you have the third piece, which is that data or the ingestion of understanding and then being able to predict what your customers want. And then, of course, I think it's kind of like any good shampoo commercial as you you just wash, rinse and repeat. So they're going back through this showcase, deliver and understand, but they're looking at how the rest of their channels touch retail and how retail touches the rest of the channels.
Kyle Well, clearly like washing your hair every day. There are some huge benefits that come along with leveraging retail successfully. But what are the red flags that leaders and founders need to look out for before they go full throttle?
Tom I actually loved what George had to say on this.
George You know, it sounds motherhood and apple pie, but the rationale for the move is so important. And if it's not completely steeped in your intimate understanding of your customers or your target future customers, then it is probably not a prudent spend of your your marketing dollars or your your operating budget. Omni channel is a buzzword and it gets used a lot, but it opens up opportunity for precision marketing, for more precision in one's marketing spend rather than than boiling the ocean, which I think is sometimes a misnomer for omnichannel. We said before you can't be all things to all people, but you can be everywhere for your target customer is the key caveat on that. So if any sort of omni channel move, whether it's a move to brick and mortar retail or whatever the case may be, is not fundamentally rationalized by a belief that it will help better support your current customers or open up new customer bases then the rationalization likely isn't there, so that would be number one and then and then number two, which is a different a bit of a different approach to spending habits and how individuals do like to shop and consume is it's less about traditional customer archetypes or segmentation, and it's more around the the actual pathways that consumers take to to making a purchase. So, you know, thinking about purchasing a bottle of wine, a lot of interesting research that research has shown that there are more commonalities in that in that purchase rationale between an individual who is coming home from work at six o'clock on a Wednesday after a long day, irrespective of demographic, than there is a female twenty five to thirty year old living in this geography. So the ability to to rethink your segmentation around what is the customer journey to get to your product can then be the opportunity to to rethink your omnichannel approach. And perhaps that would also mean having a brick and mortar experience as well to to better serve that that customer journey experience.
Tom And at the end of the day, it comes down to how best can we serve our customers? That's the focus and that's the critical question.
Kyle Matt, also built on this.
Matt Going into retail is about investing to get access to the people inside of someone else's marketplace so we can think about retail as the specialty channel or grocery channel or drug or mass or club. And when we think about it, it's important to think about if I want to go to retail, what what does retail mean to me and what are the marketplaces available to me and to my brand? And then who are the consumers that are inside that marketplace and what are they buying? Because in whatever category you're in. That category can show up very differently in each channel and as consumers or shoppers, let's say a shopper goes into a store and they're looking for your category. We simply cannot make or filter enough information to make the most informed decision possible. So consumers or shoppers. They use heuristics, so they use shortcuts to get to a decision. So if someone and I'm kind of oversimplifying it, but in one channel, a shopper might use the word natural or they might simply use the familiarity of knowing it is a nationally advertised brand so it must be good. In another channel it could be what's the cheapest. And that's going to be my shortcut for making the right choice for me. So the question becomes, what does your brand mean? What are the attributes and how do people make decisions to buy a brand like yours? And then is that suited for the retail channel that you're thinking about? And you need to understand, what is this buyer or owner or category manager trying to accomplish with their category? And how can this serve them? I mean, I think you need to lead with what the consumer wants and how we know it. And we know the consumer wants this. And here's the evidence for that. But then it's how does that serve your bigger vision? Maybe they want to grow some other way. And you need, I mean, we do this a lot where we we build a category story of why vitamins should matter to you as a retailer. So there's the category story, then there's the brand story. Then there's the product story that you're trying to sell. But it all needs to be in the context of what they are trying to achieve, because just because you have a percentage written on a piece of paper doesn't mean they're going to believe it or feel it. If we don't frame it in the context of what they want and what they need, then who knows if they're really going to believe it. We put statistics in front of people and they tell us how do we know this is true? Because there wasn't the confidence yet that we're a business partner, not someone trying to get a transaction from you. And so to me, it's really at the end of it all is we're trying to be partners in business. We are using our brand and our products to help you grow, and then you are using your business to help us grow.
Kyle Matt really laid the foundation here for anyone who's interested in branching out into retail. Number one figure out what marketplace, your consumers are already in. Number two, understand your brand equity. Number three, lead with what your customers want and the data behind that. Number four, treat your retail partner as that a partner and not a transaction point.
Tom Yeah. So all of this considered then, is retail really worth it for brands, especially brands that aren't in it right now or that are looking to expand? Is it worth the time? Is it worth the money, the stress and the flexibility when you could really be focusing on selling directly to your customers online?
Kyle This reminds me of something George said.
George So I think we're sort of starting to touch on this dichotomy of bricks and mortar that that is slowly evolving. So you have on one end the bricks and mortar flagship brand location, as we discussed earlier, the Times Square, heavy foot traffic, beautiful settings, really growing the brand equity and then this other swath on the other end, which is it's really the priority, is really about logistics and fulfillment and less about foot traffic or prime location. So you're happy to put that somewhere where the rent is cheaper and but it is in an optimized location for to to support your your supply chain. So these stores in the middle that are just your run of the mill, I hate to say it, but traditional mall settings, things like that, maybe will have a tougher time existing in the future. And frankly, it just won't make economic sense for a brand or organization to maintain at least that full footprint.
Matt Yes, Julia had a similar perspective here, too.
Julia With bigger brands, it's like kind of like how do you, like, weave all of the customer data into like one one place where, like okay a consumer that shops in a store, they log online in their account and they can see what they bought at X location of their store, or they can shop online and like I want to pick it up at like this location. And and I'd say like ideally, like everything is connected. But in reality, I don't think a lot of brands are able to, like, weave all that info together. Yeah, I would say similar to her, what I said earlier, like with omni, the expectation from a customer should be like consistency no matter what channel it is. And and like, as long as I would say, like other experience of shopping in the store versus online is the same, whether it's like the brand experience, like the creative, the the live chat person versus the brick and mortar salesperson, the experience feels comfortable and the same as what you expect that brand to be. That's kind of like the success of omni channel and the being able to get the info, the data. I would say like when you go in, like all the info that you put your purchase history in, in the retail versus online, the same, I think everything is connected and also bleeding into social media, like how your experience of social like consistently again with like the same voice and brand experience. I think that's how omni that's the success of Omni I would say.
Kyle Putting this all together, Matt really brought it home, but going back to the very beginning.
Tom A very good place to start.
Kyle Simply what are your goals as a brand? We asked Matt what this might look like hypothetically for a four to five million dollar D2C brand considering a move into retail.
Matt I think it comes down to how big do you want to be? What scale are you going for? Do you want to break that ceiling of four or five million dollars? And what price are you willing to pay for that? Because it comes with its own set of headaches? Retail partners are amazing, but they have their needs. If things aren't selling, you need to fund something to get it off the shelf. Whatever it is, you need to scale up your capacity. It ultimately comes down to what are you gunning for? Do you understand conceptually the steps to get there? And are you willing to pay the price for each of those steps? I love retail. I love the scale that retail can deliver, but not everyone can do it. And it's a risk. And is that something you want? Because four to five million dollars is amazing. That can be a wicked business. But then you're opening up a whole new can of problems, getting to retail and scaling even further. So I would support someone doing retail if their goal is to get through a ten or twenty or fifty million dollar business. But if you're happy with where you are then why put yourself through that.
Tom So should you do it? Should you invest into retail? Well, it depends on what you're trying to achieve.
Kyle Ask yourself this. How would retail help my customer more?
Tom Will it create more brand equity, more connection, more efficiency? And can we start to look at our channels more collectively, more collaboratively and focused on a singular goal of serving and delighting our customers?
Kyle So in the end, will our fabled retail fortress fall?
Tom Not any time soon. Now, despite what some people say in passing platitudes, retail is not dying. But in a digital age, it needs to look fundamentally different.
Kyle And in this re-tale of two cities.
Tom That's terrible and amazing.
Kyle The resurrection of retail will be more about revolution and purpose than it will be about evolution and profit.
Tom Remember the purpose and strengths of each channel and the future is omni channel. But your customers see your brand as one.
Kyle And it's probably time that we start thinking about our brains that way, too.
Tom There you have it. That's episode seven of Commerce Chefs. Thanks so much for listening.
Kyle We hope you gained some insight and perspective on the true role of omnichannel and whether or not a play for retail might be in your future.
Tom If you're looking for more tasty goodness. Make sure to join the Commerce Chefs community by following us on social at Commerce Chefs. Ask us questions. Send us requests. We want to hear from you.
Kyle We're currently cooking up the next episode of Commerce Chefs so tune in on April 15th.
Tom And lastly, if you liked this episode, which you did and you want to support us, which you do, make sure to hit the subscribe button and leave us a five star rating and review until next time, this has been a dash of Tom.
Kyle And a pinch of Kyle. We'll be cooking with you in two weeks.
Kyle All right, red, yellow, leather, leather, yellow, red. No, that's not how you say it OK.
Tom Red leather, yellow leather.
Kyle Red leather, yellow leather.
Tom Tommy two toned.
Kyle Tommy tickles like stoe jam in his taffiny tea house.
Tom OK, we did it were warm.